[NTG-context] Indenting (again!): a real problem in indentnext=yes

morgan.brassel at free.fr morgan.brassel at free.fr
Fri Feb 1 14:04:42 CET 2008


Selon Taco Hoekwater <taco at elvenkind.com>:

> \defineenumeration[theorem][indenting=always]
>
> This is actually easier to find, because it actually is documented
> in texshow:  http://texshow.contextgarden.net/

You're right. I found it there just after I sent the mail... Thank you, and
sorry I didn't look at it first.

> The thing is that the formal specification is not clearly defined,
> not even if you mention all cases. _You_ may not want indented
> footnotes, but _I_ have typeset a book that did.

It's not exactly about what _I_ want: my only wish was to recover the LaTeX
specification. And actually, I don't know if it is clearly defined or not. Maybe
I'm too used to LaTeX choices.

> And consider this:
>
>    Text text text text
>    \startquotation
>      Quoted text quoted text
>    \stopquotation
>    Text text text text
>
> is the next "Text" indented, yes or no? Whether this is a 'display' or
> a standalone paragraph is very much up to the document designer.

Without an empty line over it, it "should not" be indented. It's the rule in
LaTeX, and it seems quite natural (to me). If you want it indented, you have to
start a new paragraph, with an empty line or \par. All this because quotation
can be part of a paragraph. Formulae, itemize, can also be part of a paragraph,
that's why the rule should be the same for them.

Floats, footnotes, etc. "can't" be part of a paragraph, that's why the rule is
different for them.

> In english mathematical texts, Theorems and such are often seen as a
> kind of run-in header, so that "Theorem 1.  Text text text" is not
> indented, but that usually does not apply to "Proof.  Text text text"
> and "Remark 1.  Text text text": those usually _are_ indented.

For theorem like environments, I'd follow the choices of the AMS. The text
inside theorems should follow the same rule as the main text outside. The "head"
of theorems never get indented (by default).

> I am being hesitant about a 'global switch' because I fear that any
> automated solution only takes care of one particular set of settings,
> and so does will really help that much and will become a documentation
> nightmare. Imagine:
>
>     The command \indentallparagraphs will  make sure that every
>     paragraph in the document will get indented, regardless of its
>     surroundings, with the following exceptions:
>
>     * the bodies of the predefined floating objects figures, tables,
>       intermezzos, graphics.
>     * the bodies of the predefined footnotes & endnotes, and floating
>       marginals
>     * the contents of float captions
>     * the paragraph following a \stopformula, if that formula is
>       not preceded by \placeformula, and there is not empty line
>       inbetween.

\placeformula shouldn't modify anything there...

>     * any itemgroups, enumerations, descriptions, floats etc. that
>       were not predefined in the context core.
>     * ...
>
> I hope you see the problem with that. Even a simple command like
>
>     \setupindentnext[yes]
>
> does not work out-of-the-box, because you actually wanted
>
>    \setupformulae[indentnext=auto] % not yes

auto seems indeed to be the default in LaTeX.

>
>
> As I said before, it may be much easier to put all this in a module
> (by you, or someone else, but I guess you now have the list of desired
> commands pretty much at hand?). Then you can say
>
>     \usemodule[indentall]
>
> and the context core would not have to think about all these border
> cases.

I understand that it's delicate to modify the core for such questions. My point
is that I always found indenting "clear" or "coherent" in LaTeX: you want an
indented line, then leave an empty line before. In ConTeXt, I had to fight a bit
to recover this "simple" rule. But as I said, maybe I'm too used to LaTeX
choices...

As you suggest, I will put every command I used in a separate file, and try to
produce a module out of it. I'm not sure I have sufficient knowledge for this
yet, but I'll try.

Last of all, I want to thank you for all your answers, and apologize for my poor
english: I might seem a bit "rude", but this is clearly not my wish.

Best regards,
Morgan



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